Will S+ Engineering 2.1 Detect Duplicated Exception Report Imports?

Our clients would like to know if S+ Engineering 2.1 (the POSTGRES SQL form) will protect them from potentially significant oversights with respect to importing exception report blocks more than once into the same module / controller.

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In INFI 90, an exception report can only be validly imported into a module once. It must be distributed from that loop or superloop input block. If it is imported more than once, there are two dire results:

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1. Only one of the import blocks works at any time.

2. An online configuration will result in another import block beginning to work, with the one that was working freezing.

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This phenomenon even applies to blocks that are "spared out". Even if unwired, they can steal the active value. Rest assured this happens.

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In a scan of 345 systems, this error was found for 123 projects, with 862 instances, each involving two or more blocks. In every instance, correct operation is simply a gamble, and if the import block is working, it will freeze on an online configuration operation.

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DBDOC detects this situation in a useful way to protect client systems. Composer does not detect this. What about S+ Engineering 2.1?

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https://gmcl.com/Help/build_error_93.html


By Geoff Michaels on 8/17/2017 | Like (0) | Report

I should have said FROZEN INPUTS, because that is what they are.


By Geoff Michaels on 8/18/2017 | Like (0) | Report

I had some duplicate projects, along with ones with graphics only, in the data when I started this analysis. In my cleaned up set of 257 projects, there were 505 instances in 86 projects. This is a significant number.


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Geoff Michaels   

asked 2 months ago
Closed



Best Answer

1

Hi Geoff,

A relatively little known / poorly communicated perhaps, feature of Composer is that as long as import blocks (AIB, DIB, AIL/B, DIL/B, AI/L, DI/L, AI/I and DI/I) have a resolved cross reference attached, warnings are generated at compile time for duplicated imports ("input already accessed" or similar). If decommissioned / unused import blocks are also explicitly updated with a suitable unresolvable unique cross reference string eg "UNUSED.LLLPPPMM.BlockNum" the original import specs will be set to default values when the cross reference text is changed, also avoiding the possibility of duplicates.

Ensuring that all data import blocks are cross referenced or if unused, contain an unresolvable cross reference and reviewing the compile log seems to catch these configuration errors before they are downloaded to the controller.


The only time this function doesn't work is, from memory, when import blocks have a source in another project as the cross project binder utility does not create a persistent record in any of the project databases for inter-project signals.

Cheers,

Alan

Alan   

answered 2 months ago


 


By Geoff Michaels on 8/20/2017 | Like (0) | Report

Thanks, Alan.

As you know, the complex techniques simply are not used. People move conflicting IREF descriptions off blocks to get rid of errors. All imports that do not have references are legal and use the specifications in use for decades. If Composer forced people to add legitimate references, it would work, but people would yell and scream. Do you think they should yell and scream because the Composer compile does not catch this very serious problem?


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Answers

1

Hi Geoff,

A relatively little known / poorly communicated perhaps, feature of Composer is that as long as import blocks (AIB, DIB, AIL/B, DIL/B, AI/L, DI/L, AI/I and DI/I) have a resolved cross reference attached, warnings are generated at compile time for duplicated imports ("input already accessed" or similar). If decommissioned / unused import blocks are also explicitly updated with a suitable unresolvable unique cross reference string eg "UNUSED.LLLPPPMM.BlockNum" the original import specs will be set to default values when the cross reference text is changed, also avoiding the possibility of duplicates.

Ensuring that all data import blocks are cross referenced or if unused, contain an unresolvable cross reference and reviewing the compile log seems to catch these configuration errors before they are downloaded to the controller.


The only time this function doesn't work is, from memory, when import blocks have a source in another project as the cross project binder utility does not create a persistent record in any of the project databases for inter-project signals.

Cheers,

Alan

Alan   

answered 2 months ago


 


By Geoff Michaels on 8/20/2017 | Like (0) | Report

Thanks, Alan.

As you know, the complex techniques simply are not used. People move conflicting IREF descriptions off blocks to get rid of errors. All imports that do not have references are legal and use the specifications in use for decades. If Composer forced people to add legitimate references, it would work, but people would yell and scream. Do you think they should yell and scream because the Composer compile does not catch this very serious problem?


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1

No information can be given as SPE 2.1 is not yet officially released.

Govindaraj   

answered 2 months ago


 


By Geoff Michaels on 8/20/2017 | Like (0) | Report

Thanks. Obviously, if SPE 2.1 will do this, the feature must already be in place and under test by the alpha / beta sites. The only information I got privately was that there is not yet any significant new error checking implemented. Do you think it should be?


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0

SPE 2.1 is not yet officially released, so can not be answered

This is not the right forum to discuss the issues on product under Development

Deshabhushan   

answered 2 months ago


 


By Geoff Michaels on 8/21/2017 | Like (0) | Report

Thanks.

This is a forum for experts. Who else ought to have knowledge about this area? The product is scheduled for release Q2 of 2018, so it better have important things developed by now. It will be used for systems controlling plants worth many billions.

If people are not already testing this type of error detection, one must conclude it is not included. In two decades, Composer never implemented this. Obviously, if SPE 2.1 will do this, the feature must already be in place and under test by the alpha / beta sites. So far, information I was given privately was that there is not yet any significant new error checking implemented.

There are risks and vulnerabilities involved that I am sure you and other experts understand. Do you think these should be addressed by SPE 2.1?


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